From Rock Band to WooCommerce to Product with Vito Peleg

Do the Woo - WooCommerce Podcast, Community and News
Do the Woo - WooCommerce Podcast, Community and News
From Rock Band to WooCommerce to Product with Vito Peleg

Thanks to our sponsors

When you leave a rock band and start creating websites for clients, you never know where it will lead. For Vito it led to a small website agency using WooCommerce and ended with creating a product.

A Chat with Vito Peleg with WPFeedback

In episode 47, Brad Williams and I chat with Vito about:

  • How Vito went from rock star (literally) to website design
  • What role WooCommerce played in the growth of his agency
  • Why he took his business from agency to product
  • What needs were there to lead him to create WPFeedback
  • How WPFeedback can help the WooCommerce agency, developer, designer or shop owners

Yes, from rock band to WooCommerce. We start out the podcast with Vito sharing his background of playing in a rock band and how creating the site for his band led him to WordPress and WooCommerce.

He shares what challenges he had from doing design in the bunk of the band’s van to building an agency in London.

We continue the chat around the familiar note of an agency looking to move to products. It’s interesting to hear what really motivated that move and how his product, WPFeedback, grew out of it.

Vito dives more into how WPFeedback brings value to agencies and freelancers, but also the benefits around using it with a WooCommerce shop. He shares some great examples that show the need for their product and how shop owners are finding great value in it.

Brad, who is using WPFeedback, also gives us his thoughts on what it brings for the Maintainn side of his business.

Of course, the show is filled with laughter, great stories and insights, but also a chance for you to step back with Vito and hear where you can find his band’s two albums. So rock on!


Links and Resources

Where to find Vito on the web:

The Conversation

Bob: Hey everybody, BobWP here, Do the Woo podcast number 47. And I have my social distancing pal from the other side of the United States with me. Brad Williams. How you doing, Brad?

Brad: I'm good. Bob. We've been set up for this well before we needed to be with the social distancing, know what I mean? And with you way out in the Northwest and I'm way out East in Philly. We're about as far as we can get away from each other in the US.

Bob: Yeah, the only other thing would be is if you were in Florida then that would be the opposite corner. But it's far enough. Well before I dive into introducing our guest, let’s give a quick shout out to our sponsors. We have WP Security Audit Log, a comprehensive activity log of the changes that shop managers and customers do while on your site. It's a great way to keep out those hackers. Pretty impressive, you might want to check them out.

Also, A powerful event ticket functionality for WooCommerce. If you're selling event tickets and going online during this particular time, hey, you can sell event tickets online or in person when we get back to doing that.

And then, of course,, our community sponsor. You can always check out for all the good stuff they have going on. You'll hear more about our sponsors later in the show, but right now I want to dive into our guest. Vito Peleg. Vito, how are you doing?

Vito: I'm great. It's exciting to be here and thanks for having me, guys.

From Musician to Web Designer

Brad: I think this might be the first rock star that we've had on the show. I read your story on your site, which was really cool. I always like hearing stories about how people get to where they're at because I think everybody has a very interesting and different, unique journey. Many times we ended up in the same spot, but we always took a different path to get there. I thought it was interesting. Maybe you can kind of gloss over it. It's pretty lengthy and fun to read. Just tell us of how you got to where you're at today.

Vito: Sure. I actually started as a musician. When I first came to London, where I'm currently based, it was because we got signed by a record label. We moved the entire band from Tel Aviv, Israel, where I'm from originally. We moved to London to start a rock band here and started tooling around Europe. That grew pretty fast within a couple of years. It started with about 10 people at a show, then 50 people at a show, then it ended up with the hundreds and then thousands. We released two albums worldwide. We were living on the road. I was living in a van for a couple of years with the guys in a modest tour bus. From the outside it seemed like the band was really doing well but there was literally no money in this thing.

I started building websites from the van while we were still touring. We would pass by McDonald’s and we're stealing wifi on the road in Germany or somewhere like that. That was my first experience building websites for clients. After we turned 30, we had enough white hairs to stop with the music business, we kind of decided to stay in London. And we are all still here. I decided to start growing as a small freelancer from the road, to something a little bigger. Within the first year, we got to six figures of revenue in London. By year three, we had a team of 12 guys. And that was the base for WPFeedback, which is the product we're focused on right now.

Bob: Cool. And I see that Marshall amp behind you. I'm thinking we're going to get a performance here before we end the show. Right?

Brad: I mean everyone's doing concerts, right? Everyone's doing it from their house. Now's the time to jump back in and get the band together.

Vito: Yeah, that's true. This amp’s way too loud for any home use. But I have a smaller one.

Starting with the Band Site

Brad: Yeah. Obviously having started out as a musician and releasing some albums and seeing some success there. Like you said, on the outside looking in, it may not be clear, but you need to make money to survive. In reading your story, it seemed like you had a knack for it because you built out your band site and online presence, which helped. Sounds like it helped your band get some notoriety and grow. And then other bands were kind of reaching out to you like, hey, can you help us?

Vito: That was exactly the flow. I looked at it like an online launch, and within the band I always had that digital marketer mindset. We were selling our albums through funnels, where you get a free song, and then you get an email sequence that asks you to buy the album and an upsell to get the t-shirt, all done through Woo. that was my first experience doing high-level digital.

First Jigoshop, Then WooCommerce

Brad: Digging into that a little bit you mentioned all that was powered by Woo. Did you just dive in and learn as you were going? I'm curious how you ended up on WooCommerce and what factors went into that decision? Was it just the one that everybody was talking about? Were there more factors? Explain a little bit how you got into Woo and how you learned to work with it.

Vito: everything I learned was out of necessity because we needed to sell t-shirts and albums. Someone had to do it. Like most of the other stuff, it ended up on my table or bunk in the van and I just did it. I would open YouTube and figure it out. When I first started with with a WordPress-based eComm site, I was actually a big fan of Jigoshop. That was years ago, but it was an awesome solution. That was my first experience because we had a theme from Elegant Themes that was fully integrated into that system. That was my first experience playing with this. But Woo was much more flexible. You could get a gallery or directory of products and sell them. It was very straightforward, you just went to the cart and checkout. That was enough. But when we started thinking let's do some funnels and let's see what we can do with upsales and downsales and all of these kinds of things, I needed a more flexible solution and that's when WooCommerce came along.

Brad: Yeah, that's interesting because WooCommerce originated from Jigoshop as a fork.

Vito: Oh really?

Brad: It sounds like you didn't know that, which is probably why you liked Jigoshop and then you went into Woo WooCommerce definitely kind had gone well beyond what Jigoshop ever was, but there's probably some familiarity there as well with some of the features set and even under the hood because it was all based off of Jigoshop originally.

Vito: Wow. That's awesome. I didn't know that.

Where Did the First Clients Come From?

Bob: When you were doing agency work it sounds as if it was because of your connections with other bands. At what point did you expand? I'm sure you were hearing, oh, we'd love you to do our site but we don't have a lot of money, because obviously you could really relate to that. Was there some transition or did you just start pulling in other clients, or had you taken on anyone from the beginning?

Vito: At the beginning, whatever came my way, I took it and jumped on it. Because you are in survival mode you don't think about the aim of increasing revenue. You just need to pay the basics, right? I was doing random projects. This photographer from whatever show that we met at and a chocolatier that was a fan of ours and needed a website. All of these people just reached out. They were very random projects and nothing connected with bands. I did a few band websites, but I stopped pretty fast because I knew that they had no money. I figured I'm doing this to make money, that's not probably a good channel to go after.

But then we started here in London and a lot of it was starting from personal connections. With the small Israeli community here in the city. I started building websites around that. And that really allowed me to expand that circle further and further. For the first year or so, there was literally zero marketing and zero focus on customer acquisition. It was just a matter of how many projects I could deliver because there were more than I could handle. That's when I started bringing in some help from outside and building a team. I was always a team guy. That is the band mindset and I had been doing that since I was 15, that was like my second family. Now in the startup it very much feels the same kind of mindset.

It's like everyone is doing all the jobs, no one has like one role because you're a small company and everyone is jumping into projects and putting on different hats throughout the day. II believe in the power of leveraging other people's time and other people's expertise. That was a natural transition for me. And it just kept growing until it was too much for me to stay within the agency model. I looked for a way out, like a product where I could go into something that will allow me to scale further without the constant growth of the team. Because the constant correlation between revenue and team product gives you a bit more flexibility and a bit more power to grow revenue without expanding the team in a direct correlation.

The Decision from Services to Products

Brad: Yeah, we've had a number of people on the show that are in the product space and they started in the client services area. And for many reasons for exactly what you just said, right? When you're in client services there are only so many working hours in a day and you can do the simple math and say, if I have 10 people and we can bill hopefully six, seven, eight hours a day times our hourly rate, that's our ceiling, to raise your rates, or to hire more people.

Vito: Which is a very good point because when I first started my logic was, let's bring more people in. But if I would have gone a different route and tried to increase my prestige use the fact that my time is limited and just increasing the prices there, before starting to expand over to a team, because I was operating on a very slim margin for a long, long time. If the coronavirus would have happened to me two, three years ago I would be on out on the street, because we were operating on such slim margins. Every breeze of wind would have just broken this business.

Brad: Yeah, and unfortunately I think that's an all too common scenario. I think we are going to see the impact of that and we were the same way. When we were younger and smaller and a little more scrappy, , we had 8, 10, 12 people and it was exactly like you said, hanging on by a thread sometimes just trying to figure out what's going to work, especially as you're just getting started or getting on your feet. Hopefully that's not the case, but unfortunately I think it might be in some areas. It's certainly smart to always diversify even if it's not necessarily diving all into a product. There's a number of agencies, even small businesses, and I'm not talking thousands of people, but just small businesses that are doing client service bizarre, but also has a very solid product or service that generates a good part of their revenue that that can help offset that. Like you said, you can make money while you're sleeping with products and services. Whereas when you're building a website, it's more difficult to do so.

Vito: With what you're saying, I will always remember that moment. When you're working at an agency, everything correlates to time. You gotta be present, either yourself or one of the team has to be present for money to come in. But when we launched the product, it was such a joy to wake up in the morning and see the notifications on the phone like every morning and what we made while I was sleeping? That was my obsession for a few weeks in the beginning.

Brad: That's one notification you'll never silence on your phone, is that bing, bing bing. I want to hear that through all night long. I want to hear that bing when a new sale comes in. That's funny…

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And Then There Was WPFeedback

Coming from the agency side, you mentioned in a post some of tools for those building sites that anyone can relate to. Like getting content from your client, getting approval from your client to keep things on track because the longer a project's active, you're on the phone every single day. But as long as the project's active, it's costing you money and time. That's a struggle. And from that challenge, WP Feedback was born. Tell us a little bit about what went into the thought process of that and the early days of building out that product.

Vito: Awesome. We got to a point where we were 12 guys and I wanted to keep growing. I wanted to keep scaling up and my dreams were pretty big. I tried to look at ways of doing that. There is the agency model with the slim margins that are attached to this model by nature. And it really made it hard for me to see how we can get to 40, 50 people and beyond that.

As part of this research, I looked into our our profits. Where does the profit go? And no matter where I looked at it, and like you said, explore all of your support desk reports and all the project management and look at the account, talking to clients And all of that. It always came down to plant communication. We found that this was the biggest cause of profit loss within the company. Because when you really dive into it, sometimes you spend more time communicating with the client, doing revisions, trying to chase them rather than just doing the work such as designing a webpage.. That was the struggle.

From there, I said, all right, we got to fix this thing. And our initial point was charities here in the UK. That's where we settled in towards the end of the agency, doing loads of charity work. But the thing is that here in the UK the average age of a charity trustee is 74 years old. All day long, this was our audience. These were people that we were trying to teach how to use their own website and how to give us the content. They had no idea what we were talking about.

One I'll never forget. A guy sent us an envelope with the entire content of the website written on yellow pages. He even even printed out his logo and included it. I got a printed copy of the logo to use on the website. That was when something had to be done here. I started looking into ways of doing this. What we found is that the most natural way is creating the same experience from the physical world, which is pointing at something and saying, I want this changed. Its like me sitting here and If I want to talk about your door. I can just point at the door here, right? And you say, change this. Right? The point and click was very essential to the thinking process.

We saw tools like Google docs and eVision app and wanted to bring that experience into the WordPress space. And just for us, that was the beginning. It was a tool that we were utilizing inside the business. It's funny because we built this out, , I talked to my dev team and said, you look at eVision and let's try and create something like that, but inside the website where we don't need to take screenshots and upload and download all of it and have to get the customer to log into another platform. They did something really scrappy in a couple of weeks, which worked. To me it seemed like, this problem is solved. Now I can focus on finding a product, not even considering that this could be it at the beginning.

But it worked like magic and we kept getting awesome feedback from our customers around it. I said, all right, let's see if anyone else cares if this is something we can take to market. we did a survey with 600 WordPress professionals and asked them, how do you run your business? How do you gather content to prove designs, provide support? How many projects do you do in three months? How many customers do you have on care plans or maintenance programs? That gave us a lot of insight when it came to our target audience. We saw that basically everyone is experiencing the same problem that I was experiencing in my own agency.

And a really interesting take from this was that more than 70% were still using emails. even though you see all the noise out there of project management systems and support desks. We were still at 70% of the community literally using emails, which is a 30 plus year old tool that has nothing to do with the use case of what we're trying to do here. It was supposed to replace mail, like physical mail, which is the longterm communications. And email just stayed as the King for 30 plus years.

Once we launched, we saw there was a huge demand for something like this. We launched it and became the first plugin by a new company to generate six figures in revenue within the first 30 days. And from there we now we have a company. We started slowly pivoting the agency to just doing product, which is where we are now.

Brad: Yeah, it's a great product. You may not know this. I'm actually a customer. We use it on some of our small business sites.

Vito: That's awesome. Brad. No, I didn't know that.

Brad: We're on the Maintainn side and we do small business sites and it's great for exactly what it's meant for. Getting that feedback in a way that's quick, easy, and efficient. You don't have to understand a new tool or service. You're right in WordPress on the website that they're checking and they can easily leave feedback on anything on that site, front end and back end. We've been using it for a couple months now and I've really enjoyed it. It's a great product. It's definitely one I recommend. I know it's helped us because, like you said, especially on the small business side, I feel like they're less technical savvy and need a little bit more handholding than you might see on working with larger corporations that are a little more into tech.

It's exactly like you said, it's a great tool for that. And it seems like, everybody that is using it, really enjoys it. You got a lot of great feedback on the site, too.

How WPFeedback is Helping WooCommerce Shops

Bob: Have you seen anything from people that are using this on their WooCommerce store, or eCommerce site, and just how that has helped them in that process. Can you share any insights?

Vito: I can give you an example from one of the use cases that really pushed us to drive this tool to eComm as well. Initially, even before we launched, we were using this with our clients, but just the more demanding clients. We got a ticket from an eCommerce shop owner that had six and a half thousand products on there. It was a multi-lingual website, all WooCommerce and a massive websites that is the platform and the main revenue source for his business.

We got a ticket saying, I can't see the add to cart button. That's the entire email, right? No explanation, just fix it, I can't see the add to cart button. So we went to the website and we look at it and we see the add to cart button wherever we could look, and where we should have seen it. My guys were just jumping between pages and tried to figure it out, going back to the client and sending him a screenshot. We said, we can see that the add to cart button is here. And he just replies back, with us knowing he's walking around his physical shop and is talking to shoppers and talking to people. And while he's getting emails from us on his phone and trying to reply fast, he's trying to juggle all these things at the same time.

We just get a reply back. No, it's not there. I know it's not there. Please, please fix it. Please fix it. It threw us into a spin of an hour and a half of going through six and a half thousand pages on the website to try to figure out what the hell he's talking about. Eventually we found out that one of the products just ran out of stock. So, WooCommerce just removed the add to cart button on them. From that point I thought communications with our WPFeedback would have been just clicking on it, and okay, there it is. There is no button on this page. But instead it took us an hour and a half to just understand what he was talking about. That's a real life story of how this could have been really beneficial because the client could have just clicked on that area where the button should have been and we would have gotten a notification telling us that he's on his phone, telling us that he's looking at that particular page and taking an automated screenshot of what that is and not telling us which browser he is on and all of this stuff that just we wouldn't know.

From our customers another interesting use case is for bigger shops where more people are involved. When you need to align something with three different people, the one guy is in charge of the content, the other guy is in charge of actually designing the page, and other guy is in charge of providing the images. Then you have the project manager and the client and other people who are trying to work together and just deliver one result. This tool has been amazing from what we see. There is each user on WordPress anyway. You can decide what kind of restrictions and allocations each get. So, not everyone can change the status. Not everyone can generate screenshots.

And what we are seeing is it being used as an internal communication tool, a lot more than I expected. In my mind it was just a tool for agencies and freelancers to talk to clients. But now clients are adopting this themselves and using it internally within their organization to manage those shops for them.

Bob: Those are two perfect examples. And how they can be used both internally and externally. I don't work with teams but I really get the internal piece and how much time that could save.

Vito: A ton of time. It's crazy how we're not even evaluating these things. It became my game to try and value it in minutes. Because if you save minutes, you're going to save hours in the month and you're going to save thousands of dollars of salaries at the end of the year. Even small stuff like logging into the website seems mundane when you're doing it. We were just doing it on autopilot, but we are spending three to five minutes to sign up to get from the homepage to the WP admin screen, to the dashboard, to the homepage, to the edit, right? Just adding a one click login, understanding that the agencies go through that process, four, five, sometimes ten times a day saves literally an hour a day. That ends up becoming a salary in the end of the game.

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WPFeedback, an Agency Perspective

Bob: What you think, Brad, coming from the agency side of things in having done WooCommerce sites. Is there anything that really stands out specifically other than those examples?

Brad: Those are definitely really good examples and scenarios most of us are probably familiar with. I think any way you can organize communication for the client is good. Like he said, getting 10 different emails in a day about changes they want done is not an efficient way to manage anything. Even getting clients into something like Basecamp and Jira, while that's a step in the right direction, it still doesn't solve the problem.

Because, like you said, if someone just submits a ticket and says the add-to-cart button is gone and that's it. It tells you the add-to-cart button is gone but doesn't give you enough information necessarily to track that down as quickly as possible. Like Vito was saying, it's putting the time on the team.

We have an internal policy up at WebDev, we call it LSD. Which, maybe we could figure out a better acronym. Yeah, it's link, screenshot and description. And that's anytime somebody posts an update or a pull request, that's a requirement. Because again, don't put the onus on me to go figure out what you're talking about. Even internally. If it's just internal communication or code review or all the relevant information to that spot.

But you can't expect your clients to follow those type of guidelines. As much as you try, it won't happen, right? Internally you can work with your team, but with clients you gotta really make it dummy proof. I think tools like WPFeedback where you go to your website and if you see a problem, click where the problem is, add a note and we get everything we need from that. We don't have to go sleuthing around for 30 minutes. It's great.

Vito: That actually brings up a really interesting point that I think would be beneficial for Woo people here. The fact that somehow in the ecosystem we have become use to the fact that the client should not log into his own website. And that's something that a lot of people are accepting as the given,. If you need anything, just contact me. It's like don't touch it, don't ruin it. But in reality it's like if you buy a pair of shoes and you just keep them in the box the entire time. Every time you need to tie your laces, you go to the shop for the guy to tie up your shoelaces. It's kind of crazy from that aspect.

But I'm even thinking about this from the aspect of the more we get clients involved with their own websites, the more they could see the potential of this incredible platform that we created for them, which will eventually generate loads of upsells. And they think, now I'm in here. I understand how shipping works, I understand how to update products. How about we add a wishlist kind of feature. That's a great upsell for an agency. Right? Or how about we add the gift card feature to the shop? Just because they are experiencing it, these ideas pop into their mind. But if they never face the website and they never face the dashboard, they will never come up with these concepts that allow all of us to make income, including the client.

What Do the Shop Owners Think About WPFeedback?

Bob: Yeah. That's interesting because I was going to wrap it up with this. You've already answered what you see as a possibility or a benefit for the agencies and the developers. I wonder if you are hearing from them how the customers are reacting to this whole experience and is it more positive. Are they comfortable with it? Are they seeing that things are done quicker and they're not spend time answering all these emails?

Vito: Right. This is actually something that I very much care about because if the end client is not going to use it, there is no there is no reason for this tool to exist in the first place. I have asked how their clients are reacting to this. You have probably seen this in our Facebook group and other communications. I ask this question a lot and they love it. That's the usual response that I'm getting. They just love it. It's super easy to click the plus icon and it's dummy-proof. Like Brad said, there isn't a way to go wrong there.

But you do have some clients that are pushing back and this is more of a trust issue. The way that I see it, because sometimes, as professionals, we underestimate our own capabilities and that is being projected over to the client. They see that as a weakness and they start steering the ship because if this guy can tend to lead, I got to take over. He's a business owner with an entrepreneurial mindset. You don't let things hang, you fix it, right? So it's very important that when it comes to communications, or when it comes to any process, that you build within your business, that you stand your ground and you just revert the customer back to the way things need to happen.

Because you don't want to restructure your entire business, especially when you're trying to grow it around every random decision making process or random habits that they might have. You have a system, you have a flow and they need to work based on that. When we do have customers that come back with their customers pushing back, I tell them that it must be communicated that this is for both of our sakes. For example the customer we were talking that with the add to cart button we were bothering him, we felt bad about bothering him, going back to him and saying, but I'm sorry, I can't see. It's always with this kind of tone of voice. I can see that everything is fine.. No matter what I do, everything seems fine and he's just getting more pissed off and more pissed off instead of just completely removing this aberration from the equation.

So in general, people love it. But when they don't, I think that it's the freelancers’ or agencies’ responsibility to put their foot down and say, this is how we do things. Imagine your accountant sends out a spreadsheet and says, you need to fill out these things. And what if you would send that spreadsheet back and with the info and ask them to fill it in? That's what happens for us.

Bob: Oh man, that's a good example. Yeah, great stuff. I love hearing how you got into the Woo space and in your journey, you are still in it.

WordPress 5.4

Let's move on to the news before we close out. Real quick, WordPress 5.4 came out. I've dealt with it. I've been using it on three sites, two which are kind of stagnant. Nothing's floored me and oddly enough, all my sites didn't go to full screen when I updated. I don't know if Matt Mullenweg did something especially for my site. I don't know what the heck happened. But anyway, I haven't actually experienced that or been freaked out about it as many people said. I don't know if either of you have.

I do like a few other little things. It seems to be easier to select multiple blocks to delete. There's some things that I just found. They're nice little fixes, but nothing that just floored me or sent me off in a corner sobbing. I'm pretty good with it. Either one of you have any thoughts on it?

Brad: I like Bob's gauge of whether he's sobbing in a corner or not. He's like, it's a bit of a rogue release. I'm happy.

I'm always excited when there's a new version. Like you said, there's no kind of marquee feature that stands out to blow everybody's mind. But there's a lot of tightening up I think within Gutenberg and the block editor, just making the experience a little bit better, cleaning up code, making things more performant. There's a couple of new blocks around social icons and the buttons block, which I guess is replacing the button block and you can have multiple buttons side by side, which is pretty cool. I like this one, Bob. And now you can do your TikTok embeds. Now you can embed your TikTok.

Vito: You will be a big TikTok star, Bob?

Bob: Oh man, we don't want to start that. I've never even seen how it looks from the inside.

Vito: Yeah, I haven't either.

Bob: I try to avoid it, but that's another whole show.

A WordPress Jazz Playlist

Brad, you wanted to share a WordPress jazz artists playlist since the newest release, we have one more added to the list.

Brad: Basically it's a curated Spotify playlist that we manage over at WDS. And every time a new release comes, we add one of the more popular songs from that jazz musician to the list. If you're ever curious about the music behind these names with WordPress releases, we have every single one on there. When a new version comes out, we add the new one. And it's a great honestly, in this day and age, to sit back, relax and listen to some amazing jazz. Check it out.

Bob: Very cool. We will get that link up for sure so people can sit back and listen to a little jazz.

What Happened to WooCommerce in the Torque Magazine March Madness?

I know you have one more thing to share Brad, as far as some voting and how WooCommerce got knocked out of it.

Brad: I'll say, I was a little self-serving and maybe not promoting as much, but basically Torque Magazine has their plugin madness every year, in a true March madness kind of fashion, even though we didn't have a March madness this year. But basically they take the top plugins everyone has submitted and make a bracket something like a basketball tournament. And each week you vote, it's a head-to-head competition. Each week you vote on the plugin that you like best and whoever wins moves on.

Sad news on the WooCommerce front. Last week, or actually just a few days ago, the semifinals wrapped up. It was WooCommerce and Elementor. And WooCommerce lost unfortunately. They don't tell you how many people voted, but they do give you the percentage. it was a bit of a blowout as Elementor had 82% of the votes. My guess is WooCommerce did not promote or share this or I think it would have been a much healthier competition. They got knocked out. Now we are in the final and our own plugin made it, Custom Post Type UI.

Bob: Yay!

Vito: Nice. That's awesome.

Brad: That might be why I didn't share it too much because we were up against Yoast at one point and I was like, I'm not bringing this to their attention.

Bob: Yeah. And I did vote and I won't say who I voted for it, but let's just say it wasn't a page builder. We'll just leave it at that. All right Brad, well I'm going to go ahead and hand it over to you and let you wrap things up for us here.

Brad: Yeah, this has been great. Really an awesome show, Vito. Why don't you tell everyone where they can find you online, WPFeedback, Twitter, anywhere else that people might be able to track you down if they have questions or just to say hi.

Where to Find Vito

Vito: Definitely. On Twitter, @VitoPeleg, that's my personal one. And you could find us at for joining our platform. Bob is already on there and we are echoing all of the content in there already. We created a new home for the WordPress community and it's growing very fast, in the hundreds every week. And towards the end of this month on the 27th, we're bringing back the biggest online summit in the WordPress space. The WP Agency Summit. Last year we had more than 2000 attendees and it's coming back at the end of the month. Bob is talking as well. We've got some really awesome collaborations with some of the top companies in the space and they are endorsing this event as the new virtual summit for WordPress. We're expecting thousands of people to come on board and you're all invited for free.

Brad: Amazing.

Bob: Cool.

Brad: Bob's always talking, I'm telling you.

Vito: Yeah, I've heard that as well before, that's cool.

Brad: Yeah, I love it. Very cool. It was great to have you on the show and really enjoyed your story. It's fun to hear where you've been. Is there some way that we can go check out your band, some of your music, is it on Spotify or what would we look for that?

It is, yeah, just search for Chase the Ace on Spotify or on YouTube and yeah, we got both albums over there.

Brad: Chase the Ace, yes. Check it out. That's awesome, our first rock star, Bob.

Bob: Really.

Brad: I really want to thank our sponsors. Again, is our community sponsor. I think you're probably familiar with them. event ticketing, an extension for WooCommerce, a really awesome platform as well as WP Security Audit Log, real time audit log and tracking for WordPress to keep everything nice and secure.I 'm really thankful for all of our sponsors, definitely check them out. Say thank you. And as always, check out the website to subscribe, sign up for Woo news, and become a friend.

Brad Is Doing an AMA on WordPress Plugin Development

And I'll just give a quick plug myself. I'm actually doing an AMA with the my co-authors on professional WordPress plugin development, second edition. We're doing a cool AMA. Ask us anything over at Post Status on the 22nd for a live webinar and it's free to attend. I'll see if I can get a link in there for Bob in the show notes or you can just follow me on Twitter, @Williamsba. But it'll be the 22nd. I won't be back on the show before then, so I'll plug that a little bit. Come out, ask us some questions, we'll talk about the book and what's in store with that.

Bob: All right, that's it. Well, we are outta here and yeah, good stuff. Thank you again Vito. We really enjoyed having you on.

Vito: Thanks for having me guys.